Adams Cue with Wood Joint - Value and ID
11/16/2019 9:30:46 PM
Adams Cue with Wood Joint - Value and ID
I need some help identifying this Adam cue with wood joint.
Looking for identification and model.
Adams Cue with Wood Joint - Value and ID
Replies & Comments
billiardsforum on 1/3/2020 6:41:31 PMChecked a bunch of my Adam cue catalogs, and couldn't spot this model.
It's lower-end though. Nothing special.
AndyCapp on 11/24/2020 2:18:56 PM
I paid $40 for a used Adam in the 90's that looks very much like this but mine has a Helmstetter signature. I still have it. The ferrule on mine needed to be replaced so it's bigger at the tip now and I have mostly used it for pool for the last several years, but I like ash and the wood to wood connection so I'd like to have one for snooker again.
If the shaft is straight and that gunk can be cleaned off, I would happily take it off your hands if the price is right. The problem is, what the right price is for me and what it is actually worth at fair market value - whatever the hell that is - are likely different things and the latter is what you are looking to find out, I understand.
On one hand, I know they were dirt cheap, made in China, and machine spliced, but on the other hand I know they suit my preference in terms of weight, balance, and feel, and they are pretty rare these days if the fruitlessness of my searches for info on these cues is anything to go by. Having said that, I'd be curious to know what you think it's worth, frankly.
If you ever received any info about it after this from elsewhere since this post back in January, I'd love to hear what you have learned.
Mattstein94 on 11/24/2020 2:29:06 PM
I haven't received any further information from what I have above, however the pricing supplied is a long way from where I would be looking. As you have stated, the rarity of these cues would bring the price up quite a bit, and my father being a high caliber pool player in Brisbane, Australia would be able to find a suitable buyer if I looked to sell.
I'm happy to hear what your offer may be, however, it may be a case of me holding onto it a bit longer and teaching the kids how to go in-off regularly for a bit of a laugh.
LOL. I asked you first.
So, where would you be looking? ;)
Andy we can go back and forth all day if you like. :)
I'm not expressing my want to sell, however you offered to buy so I would love to hear what you would be willing to part ways with to make this happen.
OK. I'll give you the best answer I can, but I think you misunderstood the point of my earlier comment, to wit,
I paid $40 for a used Adam in the 90's that looks very much like this but mine has a Helmstetter signature. I still have it."
I intended that you understand that even after this much time, I think it's unlikely they're highly valued. But I'm not a collector; I'm a player, and for me it has great utility. I'm impressed it has lasted this long. However, I also like to write sometimes and my preferred pen has great utility but it's not worth a lot.
These Adam cues are machine spliced and mass produced. Think cookie cutter and you get the right idea. Further, the wood on wood joint is not all that desirable among players in general. I just happen to like them. So, given all the foregoing regarding condition, i.e. the ability to remove the gunk from the joint, if that's the original ferrule, and if it's straight I would make an offer, but we both know it would be well below your expectation and I don't want to embarrass either of us by naming a figure if you can get something close to what you expect based upon some knowledge or connection I don't have, with all due respect. I just don't think rare always equals valuable automatically.
Now, all that having been said, in my honest opinion, if you find just the right person, you can maybe get $200 - $300 (CAD) more than I would pay for it. Something psychological in me rebels against buying something without a price tag, but I wouldn't go over $100 and I doubt I'd agree to pay even that much, frankly. The prices of handmade cues coming out of the UK right now make it impossible for me to justify such a thing. In fairness, when I really give it serious thought, I couldn't be a serious bidder without examining it in person anyway; I beg your pardon for suggesting otherwise.
So, I'm going to tell you it might be worth about $200 - $400 to the right person on the right day, but I'm definitely not the right person and you might have to wait quite a long while for one to come along. For my part, I had someone show me a used pool cue the other day, said they paid $1200 and offered it to me for $800. I near hurt myself suppressing the guffaw. 75% of the price is the fancy crap on the butt, as far as I can tell with pool cues nowadays.
Best of luck. Ash is beautiful. I hope you get as much out of it as I have out of mine.
Andy I rate your reply highly as it shows a lot of knowledge and respectability about you. I agree with you in the sense that I enjoy playing with it as the weight and feel is spot on for how I like.
To keep a long story short, I will hold onto it. Was passed down from the old man and it may give me an opportunity to teach the young one how to put some back spin on the ball one day.
All the best mate.
Had I known about that last bit the thought of trying to buy it from you would never have crossed my mind. At the same time I understand being interested in knowing its true value.
It sucks for me, for you less so perhaps, that apparently so few of these were made they're almost impossible to find even pictures of yet for all that they aren't deemed to be terribly valuable—from what I can learn about them, that is.
There could be some stratospheric cadre of rich cue collectors who have suppressed all knowledge of these cues so they can snatch them up from the likes of you and me for a relative pittance, but that seems unlikely. Far more likely, they just stopped making them early on because people weren't buying and they disappeared because people didn't care.
I have tried many times to search for info on my Helmstetter and all I've ever been able to find is the odd forum comment. Google images has bazillions of pictures of Helmstetter and Adam pool cues but what few pictures there are of other types of cues are nothing like yours or mine. It's weird and frustrating, to be honest.
- billiardsforum on 11/28/2020 8:29:24 AM
It's an Adam snooker cue, it is not?
The number of cue lines and cue models that have come out of Adam Japan is staggering. It's often futile trying to find references or original information for certain Adam cues or Adam cue lines.
I'll continue to keep an eye out. We look at a lot of pool cues every day and come across old brochures all of the time.
Here is an Adam snooker cue similar to yours from one of the Adam Snooker cue brochures in our archives. These have a similar white joint collar, wooden joint pin, and flat butt sleeve. I couldn't find this exact cue as I mentioned earlier.
I can't tell—are they ash or maple?
They appear to be newer models than ours. Is the brochure dated?
Not to speak for thread starter, but thanks for the great reply. I think we'd both take all the information we can get.
- billiardsforum on 11/29/2020 6:45:03 AM
Unfortunately the files I have don't have the specs, names, descriptions, or a date of any kind - other than the fact they are from an Adam snooker cue line.
I tend to agree though, that the cues pictured above are likely from a more recent line than are yours.
Usually Adam Cue products with wooden joint pins are either snooker or carom cues, but the flattened butt sleeve puts yours squarely in the snooker category I believe.
As mentioned, I will continue looking. In the meanwhile if you find further info I do hope you'll share it here.
Do yours have any identifiers on the forearm? Perhaps a "made by Helmstetter" mark?
Well, again, I can't speak for @Mattstein94, whom I hope will make another appearance in the thread sooner or later, but yes, mine has the "by Helmstetter" stamp.
The name plate on the butt is the same as in your picture, but you can see the name plate on his is different.
Weirdly, it looks the same as mine otherwise so I don't get the different name plate unless mine was a repair job or something.
Mine has no Helmstetter stamp on the side, it's just a plain cue and only has the Adam logo on the butt.
I was wondering about that. It's so strange. The two cues appear to have identical workmanship, except that mine has the
made by Helmstettersignature and it doesn't have the 4-point plate, just the plain insert.The coloring of the butt splices, and even the patina are pretty much the same. Mine is out having a new tip put on because I've become far too lazy to be bothered doing it myself anymore. When I get it back I'll post some photos.
My curiosity is really fired up now LOL. I'd love to know the story of the differences between them, which came first, original cost, all that stuff, but sadly, we may never know more than we do now.
user1703364042 on 12/23/2023 3:40:43 PM
I have a wood-screw Adam snooker cue that I bought in 1982 for $250 AUD.
It was i my mind the best cue for the time. My has "made by Richard Helmstetter" on it as well.
Adams Cue with Wood Joint - Value and ID
- Title: Adams Cue with Wood Joint - Value and ID
- Author: Mattstein94 (Matt Stein)
- Published: 11/16/2019 9:30:46 PM
- Last Updated: 1/3/2020 6:26:51 PM
- Last Updated By: billiardsforum (Billiards Forum)
