Identify Frank Paradise Cue
11/9/2018 8:40:30 PM
Identify Frank Paradise Cue
I am trying to identify a Frank Paradise Original cue that was gifted to me.
There is no other player name. I know it's from the 1960's.
Can I get some help with the model name (and Level), as well as what it's value may be?
I would appreciate it.
Identify Frank Paradise Cue
Replies & Comments
Chopdoc on 11/11/2018 7:22:21 AM"Level" as appears in the Blue Book is a concept that really isn't widely used.
I don't have that exact cue in my resources. Maybe someone else does.
Very classic and typical Paradise.
billiardsforum on 11/11/2018 8:31:52 AMYour cue is comparable to a "Level 3" Frank Paradise cue as defined by and shown in the Blue Book of Pool Cues, but as @Chopdoc stated, it's a meaningless and little-used classification system in today's pool cue markets and cue collector circles.
Your exact cue isn't in the book, and as the book states:
Paradise cues were almost all one-of-a-kind, and examples usually differ slightly from the cues shown [in the catalogs].
Jursey on 11/11/2018 11:53:55 AM
Ok, thank you for that information. Any idea on what it might sell for in today’s market?
sergio8ball on 11/11/2018 4:12:36 PM
I sold a Frank Paradise cue made from a Titlist blank for $1000.
Yours is made from a regular bar cue and is worth maybe $700 to $800.
If it was made from a Gus Szamboti blank or a Burt Spain blank it would be worth a lot more, but yours is made from a regular Brunswick bar cue.
This is the one I sold:
- billiardsforum on 11/11/2018 4:32:12 PM
The Blue Book also says:
Add $500 for Paradise logo under clear plastic ring in butt sleeve
I believe yours has that (vs. a personalized name).
It looks like the window has a fog or moisture underneath. I am not sure what that does to the value or if it can be repaired.
Great - thank you all. Wanted to add it to home insurance. I appreciate all your help.
Type79 on 12/17/2018 2:21:26 PMI see this Paradise cue is now listed for sale on eBay.
I would be interested in adding it to my collection but even though there is a "Make Offer" option, I am hesitant since you have a "Buy It Now Price" of $3,999 on a cue that has been accurately estimated to be worth below $1000.
I'm not green to Paradise cues. I own a half dozen Paradise cues of varying configurations, several that are simpler than the one for sale and several that are much more complex.
PS: These Paradise windows that have oxidized can not be cleaned. They must be replaced.
I sold it a couple of months ago maybe someone else selling it
- Type79 on 12/17/2018 3:50:29 PM
I’m referring to the cue owned by the original poster.
- Chopdoc on 12/19/2018 5:45:24 AM
Cool cue. I saw the Ebay ad as well. I agree with @Type79, I would be hesitant to break the ice at that asking price.
The cue needs work, so anybody buying is also taking some risks. Generally I leave cues alone, but this one should be set right IMHO, so it needs work at least at the joint rings. I would have the butt rings and window fixed as well.
So... I am interested as well, but would not even say "hello" at that asking price.
@Type79 is a serious cue buyer, and so am I.
I think the OP is driving away potential buyers.
- Type79 on 12/19/2018 8:52:01 AM
The black Paradise cue posted by @sergio8ball did sell for $1000 but before that, it sold for $850. It lingered on the market for roughly a year with no takers.
The vintage market is and has been, very odd and unpredictable.
Yes, the cue at the top of the post does need at least minor work. A new window must be fabricated and the rings need attention. If the ring on the butt can't be fixed in place, that could present a problem, meaning more delicate work if the brass joint is pinned.
In November someone sent me pics of this cue asking for a value. Ironically, my estimate was exactly what @sergio8ball posted $700-$800. I expressed interest in buying the cue in that price range, but never received a response or a counteroffer.
Rare doesn't always mean valuable. I primarily collect Palmer and Paradise cues and have some beautiful and quite rare cues that aren't even worth $1000. I even have some rare -RICH- cues that are worth about 50 bucks! Ha!
If the OP is reading this, I am still interested but not at a multiple of it's value.
- Chopdoc on 12/19/2018 10:01:50 AM
You make a serious offer, he should respond.
I am out on this one as I just got back from Vegas (I don't gamble, just a vacation) and still have Christmas to deal with. Gotta hold onto some cash.
Yes, the market can be odd. Some of those "$50" cues end up selling for $200-$300. And some that we think should be strongly valued just aren't.
And "rare" often means little... just like "old" or "antique" may mean little.
People like what they like and will pay what they will pay, and different people like different things.
My tastes are eclectic, some of my stuff is pristine original, some not. I like what I like. More than anything I am a bargain hunter... I enjoy the hunt.
Hopefully the OP will stop by here again.
It's a cool cue, but it ain't the Mona Lisa.
- Type79 on 1/9/2019 6:36:08 PM
Crazy.
Sold on eBay for $900/Net under $800 which is less than my original private offer.
Type79, I'm sorry, but I have no record of an offer from you. I did receive your message through eBay that if I wanted to sell it to you, I should reduce the price to the cue's value. Other than that message, no offer. So Chopdoc, I did not have an offer to respond to. I would never disregard an offer.
I received this cue through a relative who gifted it to me. I planned on keeping it and asked this forum for it's perceived value so I could insure it. Shortly thereafter, a very dear friend had a sudden financial disaster and I gave it to him to sell. He asked me to list it on eBay.
Throughout the next couple of weeks, we had the cue looked at by several "experts" who gave us a value of $300 up to $3000. With us having no knowledge whatsoever of who's opinion was most accurate, we tried different numbers on eBay. I got several offers in all different ranges. Since my friend's situation was becoming more desperate, we sold the cue this evening to someone who not only made an offer, even at the high listed price, but continued to message me for the last few days.
So in short, I absolutely appreciate all the advise I received from this group. I had not seen these posts since I first asked back in November. But you have all been extremely helpful. I meant no disrespect and didn't ignore any offers made through eBay. I must adhere to their policies. I would have loved to keep the cue myself, but my friend needed the help and I did what I had to do. He is very grateful for the proceeds and can breathe for a couple of weeks.
PS the buyer states they have been playing pool for over 20 years, so I'm glad it went to someone who would appreciate it for the fine cue it is. Thanks again to you all.
- Type79 on 1/10/2019 5:57:25 AM
Some get away, but just for the record:
See my message above dated 12/19/18.
In November someone sent me pics of this cue asking for a value. Ironically, my estimate was exactly what @sergio8ball posted - $700 to $800. I expressed interest in buying the cue in that price range, but never received a response or a counteroffer.
I made several subsequent inquires through the person who originally shared the pictures, again without any response.
I also never received a response from my message to you through eBay.
Like I said, some get away.
Hopefully it did go to an appreciative collector and player and not the McDermott guy on eBay who thinks every Paradise cue is worth $5000.
I'm not going to get into a he said/she said but here is what I know and what I can prove.
Your comment:
In November someone sent me pics of this cue asking for a value. Ironically, my estimate was exactly what @sergio8ball posted $700-$800. I expressed interest in buying the cue in that price range, but never received a response or a counteroffer.
I cannot counter an offer without an offered amount. A window in a message does not work. That's how eBay works. An offer includes an amount. I saw the email where our mutual acquaintance DID respond to you and notified you we were given a higher value from another source. So those two claims are squashed.
Your comment:
...made several subsequent inquires through the person who originally shared the pictures, again without any response.
No messages from you were forwarded to me. She said she got no more. Squashed.
Your comment:
I also never received a response from my message to you through eBay.
Messages alone do not require a response. Offers get responses. I read your message and it was noted. Squashed.
Simply and in a nutshell:
You should have made an actual offer through eBay procedures, no matter what the asking price. You should have made an offer through eBay. The buyer made me an offer through eBay, I accepted it, and they won.
Now I'm all done with this conversation. I'm sorry you missed out on this cue. I won't be coming back on here because this nice informative post has now become a pissing match.
Instead of "Hopefully it did go to an appreciative collector and player and not the McDermott guy on eBay who thinks every Paradise is worth $5k", make him an offer! You never know.
Good luck.
- Type79 on 1/10/2019 10:58:05 AM
Just for clarity, my expression of interest in the cue, and my offer, preceded the cue being listed on eBay.
- Type79 on 1/13/2019 9:51:40 AM
Confirmed. The Pool Cue Shop / McDermott Dealer bought it. I would expect that after he does an amateur restoration, he will list it for sale for $5000.
This is the guy who listed a Paradise cue last year with restored points that looked like they were going through a gymkhana. He has had another questionable Paradise cue listed on eBay for six months or so.
It is sad that these cues fall into the hands of people who flip them for profit with no respect for their history.
Identify Frank Paradise Cue
- Title: Identify Frank Paradise Cue
- Author: Jursey
- Published: 11/9/2018 8:40:30 PM
- Last Updated: 11/11/2018 8:25:30 AM
- Last Updated By: billiardsforum (Billiards Forum)
